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George-Allsorts
George-Allsorts, Senior Appliance Technicial Manager
Category: Appliance
Satisfied Customers: 1448
Experience:  A whitegoods technician with 30+ years service in Domestic Appliance Service & Repair, and General Mechanical & Electrical Repair
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The main fan oven on our Belling Farmhouse 930 range stopped

Customer Question

The main fan oven on our Belling Farmhouse 930 range stopped working. The rest of the range still works well, and even the red light for this oven comes on, but no heat. We bought the range around ten years ago, and this has been the oven used most days.
How can we repair this, or get it repaired?
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Appliance
Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi I am sorry to hear that, I am Tech Michael
I will be helping you today.
Please be patient as these are technical issues and may take a bit of conversation to get the issue narrowed down and solved.
Did the fan go out at the same time as the operation of the heating?
Thank you
Tech Michael
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

The fan is not working now, but I do not know if it went out at the same time, my wife was in the kitchen and I was out on business. She was cooking, the oven was on but I am not sure if the fan was on- it only used to start up some time after the oven had been switched on. What she observed was a power failure, she checked the consumer unit and found that the RCD had tripped and everything on that set of circuits had gone out, and when reset it, everything worked except the oven and its fan.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi Pat, thank you for that information. what happened is the main control board has been damaged due to a power surge from the power cut, it happened to me last week with my online service box lol.
That board would need to be replaced. its pretty easy if you are handy and have some basic hand tools. i will help you complete this repair and save a lot of labor cost if you want, or I can direct you to a tech that can do this for you.Please let me know which route you would like to take? I will stick with you, if you simply want me to locate a reputable repair tech for this please send me your state and town information. But if you want o make this repair with my help I have listed the contact info for the best place to get that main control board.
Espares:
Sales/Parts
0844 9777 888
After sales
0333 4007 888
Monday to Friday 8am to 6pm, Saturday 9am to 4pm, or 10am to 4pm on Bank Holidays
For security and training purposes, telephone calls may be recorded or monitored.
Outside the UK? Call us on: +44 (0) 20 7717 5046.
Please don’t forget to rate my service before closing this page,
then you can always contact me the very same way at no additional cost if you have further questions about this;-)
Thank you Pat and have a wonderful day!
Tech Michael
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

If the main control board has been damaged, why is it that only this one oven has been impacted?

Where is this board and how do I get to it? Pulling the oven out of the old kitchen range it is located in is going to be a pig, so if that can be avoided I would be grateful. I have loads of tools so can probably get to this board once I know how to.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi Pat, the ovens controlled by the electronics, and has nothing to do with the top burners;-)
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Thanks. But the other oven and grill are working okay, and the timer clock and even the fan oven's red light, it is just tyh fqn oven heater plus fan that have failed.

I have to go off now, can be pick this up again tomorrow? Sorry to have break the conversation off.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi Pat yes, they are all tun through the clock controller(the main board).
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Okay but how do I get to this board? I feel I need to see it and maybe test it if that is possible before I try ordering a replacement.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi Pat, there really is no test you can do on that I'm afraid, only the factory has that equipment to do this.
Its the clock assembly that you need, its attached to the main board permanently. I have been an appliance tech for over 35 years so I am sure of the problem. No worries there;-)
When you have the part, I will help you replace it and all will be fine.
Please call Espares for that part, if for some reason they don't have one, I have another source for you.
Please rate at this point, I will stick with you until this is fixed.
Have a great day!
Tech Michael
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.
Hello Pat, my name is George..

Can I ask if you have yet checked and replaced the fan oven element as necessary?

1. If you haven't, then you need to test the element and if necessary replace it..

2. If you have, then after making sure that the element is fine and then powering up, did you switch the oven back onto Manual setting as neither the fan nor the element will work until you do
Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
hi, sorry to say, the issue is the main control board regardless I have done too many on that model and I know the symptoms and the wiring very well;-)
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.

The oven and fan are controlled by the timer... The unit has tripped the consumer unit because the cooker has an earth fault...

The most likely cause of the earth fault is the oven element since this is what the wife was using at the time that the electricity tripped..

Once the element is tested and replaced if necessary, or whatever the cause of the earth fault has been rectified, then untill the Manual Button on the Timer is pressed the oven element and fan will not work as the timer goes into Auto Mode after a power cut...

Notwithstanding this, if the timer is replaced and the cause of the earth fault is not rectified BEFORE replacement then in all likelyhood the earth fault will take-out the new timer also.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.

Hi you can try that, but that isn't the fan controller source of ground;-)

Please if you have any further questions let me know always happy to help;-)

Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.
The ground for the fan is the oven casing.. The fan and main oven element are controlled by the selector switch, which in turn is regulated by the Auto/Manual of the Timer
Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
That is true;-)
But never the less, the fact that both the fan and the oven wont work, indicates strongly the main control board has failed.
Thank you
Tech Michael
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.

Not necessarily true.. it is possible that the clock/timer has not been taken out of auto mode.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Im sure of my diagnosis, if you want to work with George be my guest either way is fine by me;-)
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Michael and George, this is confusing me! As I wrote yesterday, I had to go off in the early afternoon. But now I am back in action, though knackered by a late night. I must get this cooker working as soon as possible.

Michael, so far you have suggested that it must be the control board, and said there was no point in opening up the range to look, just to order the part, but I don't like doing in case it is not the board. In passing you mentioned that the control was associated with the clock, which is useful knowledge, but I then need to get at the clock but do not know how to get at it. I am reluctant to start taking the cooker apart trying to find a way of getting to the back of the clock, though I can see some screws under the front panel which might get me there.

George has added some useful advice, implying that I should get at the board and test it - of course testing does not mean trouble shooting the board, just checking whether power is getting through to the oven and fan. George also suggest that the controller might have automatically switched to Auto; now I have been hit by that before, many years ago in a rented house in Peterlee, but this cooker does not seem to work like that, there is a rotary switch which can select the timing mode, it was set to Manual - in the past when power in the house has failed, there has not been any reversion to Auto, so it cannot be that.

If I could get access to a workshop manual about the cooker, I could probably work through this on my own, but so far I have not been able to find that on line though maybe you guys could guide me to that, or better still send me it - the cooker is a Belling Farmhouse 930, my installation manual is dated 6/11/00 so that tells you how old the cooker is. Getting access to a manual will have made connecting to justanswer.co.uk really worthwhile.

Having you both on line is confusing, but for the moment lets keep both of you engaged to see if you could send me, or direct me to, a technical workshop manual for the beast. Meanwhile I will keep browsing to find a workshop manual.

Thanks.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi I believe George is confused about the model you have and he would have been correct but not on this one. I have been a tech and did repair many of these, I have over 35 years of experience in this field as a hands on Technician.
There really is no way to test this, but except for looking at the symptoms you have. Yes of course there always could be a burnt up wire. But in all the years I have been doing this work, may 3 times was that the case. If you really want to get this repaired soon, then please follow my advice and replace the main controller, I'm sure you will be satisfied;-)
Please rate kindly.
Thank you
Tech Michael
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I still feel I am on my own, I am working out how to access the control panel, to take out the screws below the panel and then expecting to be able to lift the panel up and out, maybe having to rotate it around the upper edge of the panel. I will just have to see, and then trace the wiring to see how far the mains power gets.

There is a several weeks delivery lead time on the part you suggest, what if once installed it still does not work?

I think there is no point in continuing this discussion, I will do the rating next time round, and I am sorry it wont be good.

Expert:  Michael replied 2 years ago.
Hi I mentioned to you what the problem is, that I am sure. You apparently don't believe my diagnosis. thats ok;-)
I wish you the best with your oven issue and have a great day.
I will opt out of this question so that other experts may offer advice.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Michael,

at the moment all I need is some guidance on how to get to see and assess the time/controller, I have asked several times for that help but you got stuck on insisting that your diagnosis is right, and on being negative about George. What George did was show me that he was thinking about the problem, I don't hold it against him that he did not already know the controls on the Farmhouse 930. Now he does!

Maybe you are right in your diagnosis, but I want to proceed a little more cautiously. I have just had to pause while I cooked a pizza for my son in the second small oven, but now that has been done, I am getting back to my investigation. If the control panel does not do what I am expecting, I will be back for more, assuming you are still in the game.

best wishes, Pat

Expert:  Andrew Smith replied 2 years ago.
Just a thought - to know for sure you should be able to check for power at the fan while the element should be heating and again at the element, this will prove whether it is just the fan or the controls. Michael is right, it would be very strange for both parts to fail simultaneously rather than just a single oven controller
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Andrew, and Michael and George,

the same problem remains, getting to the wiring to see what is going on there. I have now unscrewed the front control panel from the main case and it moves up and down a bit, but seems to be attached to the hob top with the hot-plates. I cannot shift it more than a fraction of an inch, it could just be stuck with gunge since it has not be touched or serviced, or anything in the 14 or so years that it has been installed. However there could be some fastening that needs to removed, and that is where I am hoping you can help me.

As an alternative way of getting at the wiring I have started removing the sides and back in the oven, hoping that that will enable me to check out some of the wiring - I have found the thermostat sensor, but must work on a reluctant screw to get the side wall out.

I am going to replace the light bulb while I am at it, that went a long time ago.

I do hope that you can help in these rather mundane issues, if you have done one of these recently you will know that answer. I could send photos if that would help - it seems that I could insert a picture.

Expert:  Andrew Smith replied 2 years ago.
The fan is a servcable part and so is the element.
I would suugest it should not take more than 20 minutes and a couple of screws from the inside of the oven to swap these - therefore you should be able to access them easily to check the voltage?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I have now cleared the oven, and can see a spot on the heating element where the smooth heating element has "exploded" and looks like a picture of a broken heating element that I saw on some web-site. So maybe that is it! But there was no access to any wires from the oven side, so I have now taken off the back panel and revealed the wires, but will have to cut a cable tie or two to get full access to the heater element, to isolate it and measure continuity.

So Andrew, you are right I am now only 20 odd minutes way from knowing whether that heater element is the villain, and taking it out if it is. If not, then I would still have to face lifting that panel plus hob up to expose the timeswitch and controller - it seems to have some fastening in the centre that I have not yet located, a job for tomorrow if I need to. The whole thing might have only taken half an hour had I known exactly how to open up the range, but that is what your experience is all about.

I have reinstated the cooker for use for cooking supper, my turn to cook. so that is where I am now going.

Pat

Expert:  Andrew Smith replied 2 years ago.
Well done, let me know what you find when the heating element is disconnected, it may have damged the controller at the time of the short but you will not know until disconnected.
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.

Hello all, sorry but I have been away working today...

Pat, I beleive you have found the faulty element.. fantastic...

I appologise if I got the type of clock wrong.. If there is no Auto on yours then possibly the clock has gone... Nevertheless, what I was saying amongst all the chatter was, If you fitted a new clock and the faulty part still remained on the cooker then it could possibly destroy the new clock also.

To test the clock.. test the input, test the output.. it is as simple as that.

Can you post a picture of the clock?

Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.
I have attempted to get you a service manual but Glen dimplex (Belling) say that there isn'ton for this model..

However, some of these older models had the fan wired via the element, this would explain the fan going out if the element is blown (If this is the way yours is wired)
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Thanks George, that is really good of you. I had not known that Glen (I have one two of their fan heaters), Dimplex (the heating fans in my bathroom carry this brand) and Belling were al the same. It is unfortunate that they do not have any maintenance manual, but we will just have to live with that.

And thank you or thinking about the connection between the heater and the fan - the way the oven operated was that the fan only came on around 5 or 10 minutes after switching on the oven, as if the fan was in some way connected via the thermostat.

I will update you on progress later this morning, after I have cleaned up more of the grunge around the cooker, and then opened up the back fully and checked for open circuits and short circuits. My cheap multimeter should help me crack it.

Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.
I have never seen an oven fan that works like that... Normally the fan should come on automatically that you turn on the oven, otherwise the element will stress and become damaged...

Maybe the fan was faulty in the first place and this is what has caused the element to go...

I am awaiting a wiring diagram from Glen Dimplex to help you, and I have an friend who is searching his old Belling disks to try find some form of a manual, as they did used to exist.

Please bear with me.. I know it is taking some time, but as you see, my original thought of the element going to earth was correct... so one we sort the element and fan issue, if there is still an issue with the clock, havinga wiring diagram would assist in bypassing it if it holds no use for you.
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.

I will be out until around 3pm today, but, to be going on with (so you are not hanging around twiddling thumbs), here are some numbers for you to start investigating replacement costs....

The part number for the fan element is###-##-####(You will definitely need that)...
And if I am right about the fan, then the fan motor part number is###-##-####

The original fan was on a large plate and sometimes the plate needed to be changed... If this is the case, the original plate is now obsolete (it was part number###-##-####, but there is a company doing a replacement Element, Fan, and Plate, in a set... Let me know if you need me to access one.

George-Allsorts, Senior Appliance Technicial Manager
Category: Appliance
Satisfied Customers: 1448
Experience: A whitegoods technician with 30+ years service in Domestic Appliance Service & Repair, and General Mechanical & Electrical Repair
George-Allsorts and other Appliance Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Thanks. I have been into the back, disconnected the heating element, and found that it is definitely open circuit. But getting it out has proved really difficult, and it looks as if I am going to have to remove the whole fan plus heater assembly.

Meanwhile those replacement part numbers are useful. I will keep you updated.

Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.
I have obtained 5 single page files for you ... wiring diagram is one of the pages.. I just need to find a way of uploading them for you
Expert:  George-Allsorts replied 2 years ago.

Hope this works... Let me know when you have it...

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/bao13n3t0ynch77/AAD1MUw3OPMUYw39ijwDGJmHa?dl=0

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