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Ben Jones
Ben Jones, UK Lawyer
Category: Employment Law
Satisfied Customers: 46182
Experience:  Qualified Employment Solicitor - Please start your question with 'For Ben Jones'
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QUESTION: THE DATE ON WHICH THE EXPENDITURE WAS INCURRED AND

Customer Question

QUESTION: THE DATE ON WHICH THE EXPENDITURE WAS INCURRED AND THE EMPLOYEES LEAVING DATE.Hello. I started a part-time university course that lasts two academic years in September 2014. My employers paid the course tuition fees for the (2014/15) academic year and also given me the opportunity to go undertake day release to study at university. This academic year was from September 2014 to August 2015. I have nearly finished the final second academic year (2015/16) and I have paid for this final year that runs from September 2015 to June 2016.MY CONCERN:I have handed in my resignation (4 week notice) on 07.03.2016 and have received a letter (dated 10.03.2016) from my current employer to recover a proportion of one academic year of university costs that was paid for by my employers. My final working day is 01.04.2016 and I start work at my new position on 11.04.2016.MY CONTRACT OF EMPLOYMENT:“... Consideration will also be given to the payment of a proportion of the cost and the provision of leave to attend approved training courses and examination, including day release attendance.Where an employee leaves the Company within eighteen months of completing his/her course and/or examination, the Company reserves the right to cover a proportion of the cost of such training, examinations and/or study leave for from the employee. Any such amount so recovered will be based on a sliding scale relative to the period between THE DATE OF EXPENDITURE WAS INCURRED AND THE EMPLOYEES LEAVING DATE as follows:- Within six months 100% of the cost- Between six months and one year 50% of cost- Between one year and eighteen months 25% of the cost”LETTER RECIEVED FROM EMPLOYERUnder the terms of the contract of employment [the company] gave consideration to the payment of costs associated with approved training and examinations, including day release. [The company] has the right to recover a proportion of the costs if the employee leaves WITHIN EIGHTEEN MONTHS OF COMPLETION OF TRAINING AND EXAMINATIONS.[The company] has incurred the following costs over the period of training:- University Fees = XYZ- Day release costs = XYZYou are leaving seven months after completing the course. This falls within the band of six months to one year and entitles [the company] to recover 50% of the costs, which is XYZ.Please advise how you intend to repay this amount to [the company]MY QUESTIONS.Firstly, I would just like to know what it means by “… the date on which the expenditure was incurred” and how it relates to me as written in my contract of employment. Is it the date of which my first year was paid for by the company? the day I started my course or is it when I have finished my course?Because the contract states the “the date on which the expenditure was incurred” and the letter received from employer states “of completion of training and examinations” is this the same or completely different???This is quite a substantial amount of money that is involved which I do not have and I would like to hear my options on this … also the day release costs are relating to my current salary and I have had 3 different salaries in this two year time scale, should the total cost reflect this also?Looking forward to hearing your response. Kind Regards L
Submitted: 1 year ago.
Category: Employment Law
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
Hello, my name is***** am a qualified lawyer and it is my pleasure to assist you with your question today. When did the employer actually pay the fees?
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Hello again Ben, you helped me on a previous question.I believe it was November/December 2014.
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
Hello again. So the contract states that:· You will have to repay certain costs if you leave within 18 months of completing the course.· The calculation is based on the date the expenditure was incurred and your leaving date The date the expenditure would have been incurred so the date they actually paid for the course. If this was done in a lump sum it would have been one specific ate. If it was done in instalments it would generally be when the full payment was completed. To incur means to become liable for the expenditure and that is when the payment is made – they have incurred the costs then. So the calculation date should be from the date of settlement of the course fees. Assuming this was Nov/Dec 2014 and your leaving date is 1 April 2016, we are looking at a period of around 14-15 months. So you should be liable for 25% of the costs here, not 50% as they have claimed. As t the day release costs, these should be calculated based on the actual pay you had at the time, so if these day releases covered periods where you had 3 different salaries, they should have 3 different calculations for the days In each period when arriving at the total. I hope this has answered your query. I would be grateful if you could please take a second to leave a positive rating (3, 4 or 5 stars) as that is an important part of our process and recognises the time I have spent assisting you. If you need me to clarify anything before you go - please get back to me on here and I will assist further as best as I can. Thank you
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Hello Ben.You say it is "The date the expenditure would have been incurred so the date they actually paid for the course." so would this be when my company sent a letter of authority to pay the full fees or when this was actually paid....???? As the initial email was sent to my university on 23 October 2014. ((checking my emails here)) either way I know it will be still the 25% band...
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
It would be the actual payment date as that is when an expenditure is incurred - when the money leaves them
Ben Jones, UK Lawyer
Category: Employment Law
Satisfied Customers: 46182
Experience: Qualified Employment Solicitor - Please start your question with 'For Ben Jones'
Ben Jones and other Employment Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Ben as always its been a please. Thank you for taking time to do this. Kind Regards L
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
a pleasure***Have a good weekend.
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
Most welcome
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
(Posted by JustAnswer at customer's request) Hello. I would like to request the following Expert Service(s) from you: Live Phone Call. Let me know if you need more information, or send me the service offer(s) so we can proceed.
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Hello Ben.Quick Q.As stated my company sent a letter of intent to pay for my tuition fees on 23rd October 2014, though from speaking to my university this morning it appears my company only paid the tuition fees on 30th July 2015. To me it appears my company have delayed the payment for my course for when it finishes rather than paying at the start as most people would... Would I have a case here?Also out of curiosity... can my company legally get the money back for "Day release costs"Kind regardsLuke
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
Hi, it is entirely up to them to decide when to pay the money, or rather it is between them and the training provider. There is certainly no legal requirement that the fees must be paid at the beginning of the course. For example, if there is an existing relationship between them and the training provider they may have an agreement that fees are paid at the end of training, or at any other time agreed between them. So not really a strong case there for you I'm afraid. As to day release costs, these can be claimed back if this was specifically stated in the contract, that they are costs which can be recovered at a later stage
Customer: replied 1 year ago.
Thank you Ben.
Expert:  Ben Jones replied 1 year ago.
You are welcome

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