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Jo C.
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69359
Experience:  Over 5 years in practice
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Dear Sir/Madam My Car was clamped for an unpaid fine, although

Customer Question

Dear Sir/Madam My Car was clamped for an unpaid fine, although I was led to believe it had been paid by the council, when I was offered the option to pay it off. This I did for all 5, however, they say this one was not included.

Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Hi.

My name is XXXXX XXXXX I will try to help with this.

In order to give you an answer tailored to your circumstances, I will just need to ask you some preliminary questions so that I can consider your position from all angles.

Can you give me a bit more information please?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Dear Sir/Madam My Car was clamped for an unpaid fine, although I was led to believe it had been paid by the council, when I was offered the option to pay it off. This I did for all 5, however, they say this one was not included.


Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Do you accept that you didn't pay it?

Did you change your address with the DVLA?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.


No I feel I didnt pay it


 


My address is now changed. I moved in April 2012, got the fines in June/July. DVLA details were changed in November 2012. My post office redirection stopped in October 2012.


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
So, in short, if anything was sent to you then you should have received it?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.


yes, but I never had a letter to say 1/6 was rejected

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
I'm not sure what you mean? I
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo C


I incurred 6 bus penalty fines in total, for driving at the end of the bus lane to turn left, as the right lane is traffic going to the right (and Im going left). I did this for approx. 2/3 weeks, then had 6 fines land through my letter box some time later. I paid the first 3, no quibbling, when I got the next 3 I was financial heartbroken. I appealed these and EVENTUALLY in September I believed I was given the option to pay them all at the 50% discounted rate after pleading and writing to my MP who wrote to them. At this point I paid the last three all off, or so I thought. The fines were always referred to collectively. In October my redirection expired, and council apparently wrote to me at the old address in September saying 1 was not accepted... I never received this correspondence stating it was unpaid nor that this 1 fine was not part of this deal!!! Next thing 1.5 years later my car is clamped!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I show via credit card statements that I have paid the fine I was clamped for. To cover they say they reimbursed me for two due to ONE admin error! (So why two?). However, I was only aware of one error. I have verified this with my credit card company and have indeed been reimbursed £130 which suggests two fines. In my opinion the council have made a few errors, like we all do from time to time, however, why have I been charged £500 for their mistakes when they got their money in the end. Why would they reimburse me if 1 fine is still outstanding. Why would I respond to 5 fines and not the other??? Sorry I know its confusing - but in short I can show I have paid for 6, reimbursed for 1 error, but their email says I paid a fine twice!!!!!!!!!!!! why on earth would I do that, when I don't want to pay it in the 1st place.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Yes, I understand all of that.

What I need to know is this.

1 Is the issue that you didn't pay one fine in particular?

2 Or, is it just that you paid them all but not the full amounts because you though the 50% discount applied?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Oh sorry


Is the issue that you didn't pay one fine in particular? Yes


 


When my car was clamped they said one fine was outstanding, not an amount.


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

In relation to that fine, did you get the PCN originally? You seem to accept that you did but just for clarity?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

yes I did get it


 


but


 


not when they rejected my representation, as I thought the 50% was also being offered on this one too.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
I'm sorry but I don't understand what you mean?

The PCN is issued before the rejection letter - by definition.

Also, either you got it or you didn't?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Yes I got the original PCN

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Good.

Did you appeal that?

What was the outcome of that specific appeal if so?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

yes I appealed along with the rest within the 28 days given


 


I don't remember what the decision was on that particular one, as it was more than one that was appealed. Eventually after writing to the MP who wrote to them. I was given the opportunity to pay the remainder at a 50% discount and I did.


 


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

You need to get to the bottom of that. That is something you would have to get from the Council. The bailiffs cannot help with that.

In relation to the bailiffs, its not likely a claim exists against them. Ultimately there was a warrant at Northampton and they are free to act upon it. They are able to claim vehicles if no payment is received upon the order. There is some case law that suggests they should only be charging for clamping if payment has been refused by the debtor. That may be something that can be pursued but it doesn't deal with the underlying claim.

If the fine was paid off in full then the matter should never have gone to Northampton and any action that arises from it is void.

If it wasn't paid off then they are entitled to act upon it. You still should have receive a Notice to Owner, a charging order and a warrant.

If you did not then you may be able to make a statutory declaration on that basis. Of course, it may be refused because probably the reason that you didn't get those documents was to do with the cross over in address at the DVLA. They do not always refuse on that basis though.

If the stat dec is accepted though then you will be entitled to a refund.

Can I clarify anything for you?

Jo
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69359
Experience: Over 5 years in practice
Jo C. and other Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

ok thanx for your response, how do I make a statutory declaration? and who too?

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
The Traffic Enforcement Centre will send you the forms.

You will find them here

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/northampton-bulk-centre/traffic-enforcement-centre

They used to have the forms on their website but I can't find them now.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.


Hello Jo C


 


I have made contact with the court to obtain a statutory declaration and they say,because I believe I have paid it, I do not fit their criteria, therefore my only option to seak legal advise or visit the CAB or go back to the council.


 


I'm now not sure what to do. Do you have any other thoughts on this pls?


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Sorry but I thought you said that you hadn't paid one of them?

That was the one I was suggesting a stat dec upon.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.


Hi Jo


 


I thought I had, but apparently I had 1 outstanding - my redirection had finished so I didnt get any of their letters


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

If there is one outstanding then you can make a stat dec on that particular fine.

Customer: replied 2 years ago.


even if I have now paid the bailiffs?

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Yes, all that will do is trigger your rights to claim a refund.

But you seem to be saying that you have not paid the bailiffs?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Sorry Jo was on leave so just saw your response. Happy New Year


 


When the baliff claimed my car for the unpaid fine, I paid them to release my car.


 


I am so confused as the council wont answer any of my emails they say the matter is closed. The stat dec people say because I thought I paid it, I need to back to the council and they cannot do anything.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
The matter is closed then from the council point of view.

You can still make a stat dec. People do it all the time.

But then you need to claim from the bailiffs.

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