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Jo C.
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
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Experience:  Over 5 years in practice
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I have been screwed over by a supplier who would not

Customer Question

I have been screwed over by a supplier who would not refund me for faulty goods and RBS invoice finance has taken me to court to get the money due.

I have never signed any credit account application so I have 2 applications.

How can RBS take me to court, i have never had any contract with them.

If there is some sort of implied contract RBS have records where I have told them that the sum is in dispute, despite this they have carried on to court without any attempt to reconsile the difference between supplier and buyer.

Sadly I missed the deadline for my defence so the CCJ was carried through without defence and the solicitors involved (who only sent me one letter prior to court) took out a Writ to get the money within days of the CCJ. this has cost a further £1500 in costs over what is a pretty much rip off charge.... Am i banged to rights?
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Hi.

Thank you for your question. My name is Jo and I will try to help with this.

How much do you owe please?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi jo, around £3500


but we have around £1500 - 2000 of equipment to return

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Hi

Sorry for the delay. I'm at a court with a poor internet connection.

RBS are factors. The company you were in dispute with have sold the debt to RBS at a discount. You are entitled to see a copy of the assignment which entitles RBS to the money.

If they got judgment in default against you then you may be able to apply for it to be set aside. That will depend on how long ago this was in court. Courts hate delay. If you were notified and did not attend then you can usually get away with a delay or a month or so but not more.

If it has been some while since you got the judgement then you really have little option other than to try to negotiate with RBS to come to a settlement.

How you deal with this will really depend on whether you are a limited company or a private individual, how much the debt is for, how long ago you got the judgement, and what documentation you have with regard to your complaints about the faulty goods.

If you can let me have that information then I may be able to offer more?

Jo
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo,


The default CCJ was put in place late November - we called as soon as we had the information asking about an appeal as we were expecting a court date.


 


We called the original supplier of the goods as i was told by the courts that if we had resolved the issue within 30 days and paid in full the CCJ would "vanish". Negotiations were looking promising - we were getting close to sending the faulty equipment back for a refund and paying the remainder until my wife opened the door to a nice man who turn out to be a "sherrif?"


who scared the life out of her and gave her a walk in notice (I have talked to him and he seems actually quite reasonable and has helped us with what to do to keep him away over christmas).


 


this was due to the solicitors "shoosmiths" taking out a writ within the 30 days adding a further 1500 to the bill. this effectively ruined any chance of a satisfactory outcome with the supplier.


we attempted our first appeal Mid January which was seen by a judge and thrown out as on the 244 form I had put my name then ticked defendant instead of other and written director of a limited company.. so we have now paid another £125 to re apply!!!


This appeal will be seen by a judge before the end of this week to stay the writ hopefully!!!


 


Complaint paperwork is scarce as most of the procedure is done by phone - I have some emails which admit an issue from the supplier who say they will get back when they have a resolution which never arrived..


 


RBS have refused to give me a copy of their internal records although they admitted that there was a record in September of a phone call where I told them there was a dispute on the payment.


 


I have been called several times by RBS and have told them each time there was a dispute but sadly as they made the call these records are with them and apparently inaccessible.


 


The business is currently not doing too badly but this BS to be honest makes me feel like shutting the doors starting up as a sole trader and walking away leaving the rats to fight over the spoils. but my morals are a bugger hence wanting to fight not flee.


Trading with a CCJ makes it almost impossible to carry on business but i am trying anyway!!


 


Thanks again !! sorry to rant on!


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks. No problem.

I'm due in court this morning but I can probably look at this at about 10.30 if thats OK?
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

If you are going to appeal a small claims court judgement then it must be done within 21 days.

If you did not get the papers then you can apply to set it aside which means that it will be heard at a later stage but you must not unnecessarily delay. You can still apply to court to set aside the County Court judgement after a month using form N244, provided you have a valid defence which you appear to have done. You did this last year and I think the judge was perhaps a little harsh in rejecting the application at that stage for what was obviously a slip. However, he did and there is nothing you can do about that.

You mention November? I presume that this is November 2012 not 2013? If so, then it is over a year ago and you do not have the right to appeal it. You also have no absolute right to negotiate. The claimants have judgment and they are entitled to payment.

If you had reapplied to set the judgement aside last January or February then I think there was a chance that you would get it set aside. Its unlikely that if you do it now it will succeed because the courts will not sanction a 12 month delay. By all means try it, but I would not pin my hope on it being set aside, simply because of that delay

It appears that the claimants have been disingenuous by appearing to negotiate but meanwhile applying for a further order to instruct bailiffs. They are free to do that though.

Bailiffs do not have the right of entry unless they are invited in. Once they are invited in, they can break in on future occasions and can also break internal doors all walks or cupboards. The notice was a walking possession notice. Not a walk in notice.

I am extremely surprised that for a debt of £3500, which is small claims court they instructed solicitors as costs are not awarded against the losing party, in the Small Claims Court. That does not make sense. Nor does the additional £1500 and you are going to need to investigate that. I imagine that if you did not turn up at court, they have simply asked for costs and the judge has awarded it. You need to look at the exact wording of the original judgement and raise it in court.

In relation to setting the judgement aside, the judge will not look at your defence in depth at this stage that will happen in the future at the proper hearing. He will simply look at the defence and see that you have one which you do.

Do not try to deal with this on the telephone because you will have no record of what was done. If you do deal with things on the telephone follow everything up in writing and then you have a record.

Jo
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi jo,


thanks for the previous advice,


I have a hearing next week and hope that it can be settled once and for all...


I have a few small questions...


the claimant has just sent their statement and exhibits - i have rebuttle info - which includes emails etc do i need to send these alone or add a statement with them? if so how far before the case do i need to reply...


RBS have still not released details of the notes from our phone calls (they are pretty damming as i have always said the figure is disputed and i would pay once a balance is given) can i include this refusal to supply info as evidence?


 


also the claimant is quoting mitchell v news group - as far as i can see this isd all to do with apportioning legal costs... is there anything i need to worry about?


 


the original case was October 2013 - i first appealed December .. ironically the claimants solicitor has included court paperwork in the exhibits


on the general form of judgement of the original appeal the order date is 19th December, the date in the top right corner under the claim number is 24th December and the solicitor has date stamped the paperwork 31st December... showing nearly 2 weeks processing can i use this time line as a possible reason the processes have been delayed - it has been a real worry receiving paperwork from courts over a week after it was issued all through this process


 


 


 


one final thing (honestly)


the writ application form is signed as pp shoosmiths in part 1


the signature in part 3 is shoosmiths


also quite disturbingly the court officials initials "look" to be in the same hand


and on the actual writ itself (I believe to be issued by the court not the solicitors?) the date is in the same hand as all dates on the application... can this be right?? it looks wrong to me??

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks but I see you have been displeased with my responses so far so I will opt out.

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