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Jo C.
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
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Experience:  Over 5 years in practice
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Dear Sir/Madam, Approximately 20 months ago I applied to RED

Resolved Question:

Dear Sir/Madam,
Approximately 20 months ago I applied to RED Driving School to become a Driving Instructor, I paid my £1495.00 up front but due to various circumstances I changed my mind(if you changed your mind within 7 days you were entitled to a Full Refund, if you changed your mind after the 7 days but within 21 days you were entitled to 50% of the £1495.00) However when I applied for my refund after the 7 days expecting 50% of my £1495.00 I was told in no uncertain terms that I wasn't entitled to it. My wife and I challenged their decision but again was told that we weren't entitled to it. I know that I have left it some considerable time, but I still have all the documentation, e-mails and correspondence. I am asking if I have a claim against RED for the 50% of the £1495.00 and if you think I have a case. Thank You. Kind Regards XXXXX
Submitted: 3 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Hi.

Thank you for your question. My name is XXXXX XXXXX I will try to help with this.

Were you outside of the time period?
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

The Notice of your Right to Cancel states that I had 30 calendar days from the start of the Customer Declaration (Agreement) to cancel. The agreement was dated 06/07/12, I signed it and it was also signed by the RED consultant. I e-mailed them on the 27/07/12 stating that I wish to cancel my enrolment for the RED Instructor Training Course saying that I was sending them the cancellation on day 21 of signing the course agreement ,that I have posted back the Official DSA guides with the ADI Part 1, their CD and that they had been sent by recorded/special delivery at a cost to me of £7.55 ( I have the original Post Office receipt) so yes I feel that I was in the required 30 day cancellation period. Thank You.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Thanks.

What do they say on the point?
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

Hello Jo,


I am sorry for the delay,but to answer:- Miss Katie Raven(customer service manager) replied to my wife and I saying that the Course Agreement clearly states that withdrawal within 8 days of enrolment, entitles you to a full refund, there after there is no refund due.This is stated in the notice of right to cancel that you were given at the time of enrolment.Ms Raven then quotes point 8 of the Customer Declaration, which says and I signed that I understand that it is my responsibility to make a full disclosure to RED of any existing physical,medical or mental health issues which may affect my ability to complete the training or carry out the tasks of a Driving Instructor.If I have any doubts about any issues, I understand that I should consult my doctor as soon as possible so that if he/she advises against it, I can cancel my contract within the eight day cooling off period and obtain a full refund. If however your medical condition occurred after the date of enrolment, we require written confirmation of your medical condition and the date the condition was diagnosed, from a professional medical consultant in order for us to consider your application further.


My wife sent a letter on my behalf dated 02/08/12 saying that I was unwell and a letter giving my wife (Anne Bluett) or my daughter (LIsa Holliday) authority to act on my behalf as I was suffering from a bad dose of influenza (having Hot and Cold sweats,shivering and shaking) I was bed ridden for a number of days) and completely out of sorts for approximately two weeks.Following the Influenza (which really took it out of me both physical and mentally) I suffered a period of Depression, I saw my doctor on the 20/08/12 and was prescribed Citalopram (20mg) After 3-4 weeks of taking the Citalopram I felt somewhat better and the Depression lifted.


When I applied for the Driving Instructor's position I was feeling well, I was fully capable to drive, I was alert,sensible and level headed, if I wasn't I would Not have applied to become a Driving Instructor. There was No Doubt in my mind that I wouldn't be able to complete the course and carry out the full range of Driving Instructors duties. However I challenge what Ms Raven said because on the Notice of your right to cancel which has my name- Mr John Bluett, my enrolment number- S605272 and the start date- 06/07/12, it says that This form sets out your rights if you wish to cancel the Agreement with RED for your Instructor Training Course, You have up to 30 calendar days from the Start Date of this Agreement to cancel, but the amount of refund received will depend on when you choose to cancel.


Cancellation sent within 8 working days of the Start Date on this Agreement - 100% of amount paid.


Cancellation sent after 8 working days but within 30 calendar days of the Start on this Agreement - 50% of amount paid.


This is for all courses that involve more than one Part and payment made in full at the commencement of the course.


It then goes on to say For courses comprising a single Part only, and all courses that involve payment by instalments.


I paid £1495.00 and was to pay £83.75 per month for 12 months but the Course Details says that the training programme is designed to dovetail with the Driving Standards Agency's three part test and you must pass each part before moving on to the next stage You can take the Part 1 test as many times as you need to, although you'll be pleased to hear the majority of people pass first time. You then have up to three attempts at passing Part 2 and Part 3, as I have said I have all the paperwork if you require it. I hope that this helps .Thank You.


John Bluett.


.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Ok. This doesn't make much sense.

Why do they say that the 50% refund doesn't apply in your case?
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

I paid the £1495.00, I cancelled within the 30 day period and the course was to be in three parts. I can only think that she has based her response on the part paragraph that says (and all courses that involve payment by instalments) I paid the £1495.00 and was to pay £83.75 by instalments over the following 12 month period. I feel that I qualify for everything else, that is the only point that weakens my case, unless you could see any way around this. Thankyou.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Has she not given you any reason at all?

It would be worth going back to her and asking her this question to get to the bottom of this.
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

I e-mailed the Customer Services Department on the 27/07/12 stating that I would like to cancel my enrolment for the RED Instructor training course (this was on day 21) This was answered by the Customer Services Department on the 01/08/12 saying that Ms Katie Raven was the Customer Service manager and that any appeals/complaints should be sent to Ms Katie Raven, also that I would need to give written authorisation, as this would allow RED to discuss my account with my wife.


On the 02/08/12 my wife wrote to Ms Katie Raven saying that I was unwell ( I was in bed with a bad dose of Influenza) that all paperwork, the CD and Books had been sent back (unopened) by Special Delivery, My wife also wrote that if she required proof of my illness then details of my doctor would be given if required, a letter stating that my wife (Anne Bluett) or my daughter (Lisa Holliday) were authorised to act on my behalf concerning my enrolment signed by myself.


This letter was answered by Ms Raven on the 03/08/12 saying that - The Course Agreement clearly states that written withdrawal within 8 days of enrolment, entitles you to a full refund, there after there is no refund due. This is stated in the notice of right to cancel that you were given at the time of enrolment


On enrolment, all students sign the Course Agreement, of which the terms and conditions are legally binding. Adhering to these terms and conditions ensures that all our students are treated equally. When students enrol they are asked to read and sign a Customer Declaration form, when signing this you are agreeing that you have no pre existing medical conditions that will affect your ability to complete the course.


Please refer to Point 8 of your Customer Declaration:


8. I understand that it is my responsibility to make a full disclosure to RED of any existing physical, medical or mental health issues which may affect my ability to complete the training or carry out the tasks of a Driving Instructor. If I have any doubts about any issues, I understand that I should consult my doctor as soon as possible so that if he/she advises against it, I can cancel my contract within the eight day cooling off period and obtain a full refund.


If however your medical condition occurred after the date of enrolment, we require written confirmation of your medical condition and the date the condition was diagnosed, from a professional medical consultant in order for us to consider your application further.


Unfortunately we did not reply to this letter until contacting yourself.


Thank You XXXXX

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Thanks. I'm sorry if I am being unclear.

What I need to is this

1 Did the actual contract say that you were entitled to a 50% refund if you cancelled within 30 days?

2 If so, why do they say you are not entitled to that refund as you are within that period?

Just a brief summary will be fine. Please don't put yourself to detail.

If you don't know then that is fine as well.
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

The Head of RED Instructor Training has a paper attached to the Customer Declaration saying, to accept the offer for the refund of my course fees, we would be grateful if I could sign the attached letter, to confirm that I am happy with the Terms and Conditions of the offer. I along with the RED consultant signed this on the 06/07/12. The offer was- Course Fees are refunded in three instalments to a maximum refund value of £2500.00, an example is given as Course Price £2500.00


Refund 1. £500 Refund 2. £1000 Refund 3. £1000, each refund can be claimed a minimum of 6, 18 and 30 months.The Customer Declaration only mentions Paragraph 8 as previously stated. The Notice of your right to cancel states what I have previously said. There was No Actual Contract signed. Thank You.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
Okay. Thank you.

So, surely that does not say that you are entitled to a 50% reduction? I'm sorry if I'm missing the point but it's important to understand these points
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

The Notice of your right to cancel says on Part One


 


This form sets out your rights if you wish to cancel the Agreement with RED for your Instructor Training Course.


 


For all courses that involve more than one part and payment made in full at the commencement of the course.


 


You have up to 30 calendar from the Start Date of this Agreement to cancel, but the amount of the refund received will depend on when you choose to cancel.


 


Cancellation sent within 8 working days of the Start Date on this Agreement - 100% of amount paid.


 


Cancellation sent after 8 working days but within 30 calendar days of the start date on this Agreement - 50% of amount paid.


 


For courses comprising a single Part only, and all courses that involve payment by instalments.


 


You have up to 8 working days from the Start Date of this Agreement to cancel.


 


Cancellation sent within 8 working days of the Start Date on this Agreement - 100% of amount paid.


 


Cancellation sent after 8 working days of the Start Date of this Agreement - No refund.


 


I will go back to All courses that involve more than one part, the actual course was in three parts. Thank You.


John Bluett.


 


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.
I see.

Its one of these things that may have to be argued at court I suppose.

Either way though, they only have a claim under the contract for the sum of their loss. If you cancelled early and used little of the course and this is not a course where there is pressure on places then its quite unlikely they have suffered anything more than admin losses.

On the basis of what you have said, the contract is clearly on your side. I cannot understand why they say that no refund would apply at all. I suppose we haven't heard their justification for this as they just seem to be ignoring the issue.

Can I clarify anything for you?

Jo
Customer: replied 3 years ago.

Hello Jo,


Thank You for your e-mail I now feel in a better position to proceed and will e-mail RED for their response. I wish to put on record that the service I have received from yourself has been excellent, really informative and has put me in a better position to address this matter with RED, I know that I may have been a bit long winded at times but I thought the more information you had the better. You provided a service that I will highly recommend to anyone that I know who requires Professional help, once again Thank You.


Kind Regards XXXXX

Expert:  Jo C. replied 3 years ago.

No problem and all the best.

Remember that I am always available to help with your questions. Even if I am in Court I will usually pick up a question within 12 hours. For future information, please start your question with ‘For Jo C’. You can also bookmark my profile http://www.justanswer.co.uk/law/expert-remus2004/
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