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Jo C.
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69790
Experience:  Over 5 years in practice
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Hi I have just received a summons for speeding and not naming

Customer Question

Hi

I have just received a summons for speeding and not naming the driver 172 offence sadly I never received the letter for the speeding offence so of course was not aware I had committed speeding I would of gladly of taken the fixed penalty and fine as I have a clean licence now at worst it looks like 6 points for the 172 and 3 for speeding I have a form to return to the court on how to plead happy to plead guilty to speeding but not the naming of the driver as I never got the letter some people suggest if I admit the speeding then the 172 will get dropped as you are naming the driver in effect by admitting the original offence is this the case? any help appreciated
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Hi.

Thank you for your question. My name is XXXXX XXXXX I will try to help with this.

Is the car registered to your address please?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo


 


yes it was the speeding was in Oct 2013 but I did scrap the car in Jan 2014


 

Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo


 


yes it was the speeding offence was oct last year I scraped the car in jan 14

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.

Did you declare it SORN?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Joe


 


The car was taxed always and scrapped in Jan I got a refund for the tax disk and the paperwork when I got the car taken away

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.

Are there any difficulties with receiving your post?

There would have been one NIP and a reminder sent to you.
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo


 


sometimes we get other peoples mail but generally its very good I have been told they don't always send a reminder so can assume in my case they never as I cannot believe 2 letters would of gone missing it seems I have to prove I never got a letter but how can I or anyone prove that really likewise for the police how do they prove they sent it?


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.

Have you complained to the post office about anything else going missing?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Never


 

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

What was the speed limit and what speed were you doing?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

limit was 70 doing 85

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Thanks.

There is no point in filing out the paper forms. You need to attend court.

If you attend court and offer a plea to speeding in exchange for dropping the failing to identify then the Crown will probably accept it. I used to prosecute traffic courts all the time and its rare that CPS pursue failing to identify if speeding is available.

Proceeding on the basis that you do meet with an unreasonable prosecutor who digs his heels in and refuses then you will have to have a trial. You will be charged with failing to identify and speeding in the alternative. You can plead not guilty to the failing to identify. If you didn't get the S172 form then you can't identify the driver.

The question really will come down to whether or not the Bench believe that you didn't get the forms. There are points on both sides. You are asking them to accept that two separate correspondences went missing which is beyond a coincidence. It is possible but they will want to know what happens to your post and how likely it is that they could have gone missing. That said, the Crown won't have any evidence that you received them. All they will be able to say is that they were placed in the post. It will really come down to how credible you are on that point.

Overall though, unless you are wildly incredible in court, probably they would believe you on this evidence.

Can I clarify anything for you?

Jo
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I have been told they do not always send out a reminder and are not under any obligation to do so on the court summons part of the evidence against me shows that a letter was sent along with a date but it does not state a second was sent

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
No, they are not under any obligation to do that but they will have done it. Its rare that they don't now.

Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69790
Experience: Over 5 years in practice
Jo C. and other Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Okay thanks for your help I guess I will have to see a solicitor I have seen a local firm who I have used several times for help with property just so annoying its going to cost me a day off work to see them then another day off for court solicitor fees all for not getting a letter sadly I feel the system is against me I have been driving for 19 years and this is the very first time I have had an issue crazy world we live if this is how honest people like me get treated oh well thanks for your time tonight just gutted this is how it is going to cost me £1000 plus for loss of earnings then solicitor fees

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
You don't have to use a solicitor. Many people do appear unrepresented for this type of thing.

Unfortunately, it is something that you need to resolve by attending court though. Even if you write in offering these pleas CPS will probably just ignore it like they do all the defence statements I write for them.

You will probably win in court.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.

Thank you for the positive rating and remember that I am always available to help with your questions. For future information, please start your question with ‘FOR JO C’. You can also bookmark my profile http://www.justanswer.co.uk/law/expert-remus2004/
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hi Jo


 


Sadly like I said this is all new to me and I know very little about how this all works so the thought of court along with fines and 9 points scares me and so far I have no faith in the legal system by the way this has been done how can I defend not getting a letter I imagine they hear this all the time im just another one I guess thank you for your help though just wish I could talk to the CPS like this but sadly I guess being honest would just go against me

Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
Ok.

Did you want to know anything else about this?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.
Is it possible to avoid court and just speak to the cps happy to accept the speeding as the date time all makes sense but not happy about the 172 as I never got it seems silly to waste people's time
Expert:  Jo C. replied 2 years ago.
No realistically.

They just won't discuss it otherwise than face to face.

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