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Ash
Ash, Solicitor
Category: Law
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Experience:  Solicitor with 5+ years experience
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I NEED AN EXPERT IN THE DATA PROTECTION LAWS AND POLICE . IF

Resolved Question:

I NEED AN EXPERT IN THE DATA PROTECTION LAWS AND POLICE . IF YOU ARE ARRESTED AND THE POLICE HAVE THE TWO RESIDENT PSYCHIATRIC NURSES AND LATER TWO PSYCHIATRISTS AND AN ASW TO COME AND EVALUATE YOU CAN THEY CLAIM THAT THIS INFORMATION IS PROTECTED UNDER SECTION 28 OF THE DATA PROTECTION LEGISLATION ?( DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation. ) I HAVE A SERIES OF QUESTIONS THAT RELATE THE ABOVE THAT THE POLICE ARE CLAIMING FALL UNDER THE DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation. THIS IS A SAMPLE QUESTION I HAVE QUITE A FEW THAT I REALLY NEED CLARITY ON.
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Alex J. replied 2 years ago.
Hi,
Thank you for your question and welcome.
My name is ***** ***** I will assist you.
I am experienced in the Data Protection Act. Most of the laws revolve around the facts and application of reasonableness.
What evidence have you been given that they are entitled to rely on the S.28 exemption?
Kind regards
AJ
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Would you like the full list of questions associated with this matter so that you may have a clear picture of the problem ? I can attach both documents if this is helpful

Expert:  Alex J. replied 2 years ago.
Hi,
Thank you.
Yes please send me the further questions.
Kind regards
AJ
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Detective Inspector Jon Gross


Specialist Crime Command


Sussex House


Hollingbury


Brighton


BN1 8AF



16th September 2014


Dear Mr McFadden,

Re. Issue raised regarding your case – reference *********** /strong>

This letter is sent as a follow up to my correspondence to you dated 23rd August, and the 4th and 8th of September, and also the emails sent to you by T/DS Harmer on 12th and 16th September.

I hope to be able to clarify a number of issues you have raised and think it beneficial to list them here:



  1. Bail variance to the pre-charge bail conditions currently imposed upon you.

  2. Access to a copy of your police interview.

  3. Access to data regarding material and personnel involved with the investigation.

  4. The registering of a complaint about the police handling of your case.


In order to respond I have liaised with a number of colleagues who would be considered policy leads or subject matter leads for some of the areas of process your requests touch upon. I have done so in order that you can be assured my responses have the benefit of experience and perspective that is not just my own.

I anticipate you may wish to contest certain points further, and of course that is your absolute right. I refer back to my comments in my correspondence of 23rd August, my staff and I are acutely aware of the significant impact this investigation is having on you and as such it is important to be able to justify actions taken, and expedite matters where at all possible.



  1. 1. Request to vary bail conditions (email to T/DS Harmer 1st September)


The rationale for imposing the current bail conditions is predominantly a safeguarding one. In any case where we are investigating a suspect for matters that indicate the possibility of a sexual interest in children we impose bail conditions that elevate the safeguarding of children connected with that individual to the fore.

While you remain under investigation we rely on colleagues from Children’s Social Care to update us that they have assessed whether you represent a risk of contact offending or not, and to what degree that risk might be manageable by an alternative to the bail conditions imposed.

To date our liaison with the Social Worker in the case indicates it has not been possible for them to conduct a risk assessment.

As there is no new information or assessment that I can refer to, as frustrating as it is for you, I am bound to err on the side of child protection. On the basis of the matters under investigation I cannot discount that you do have a sexual interest in children and as such you represent a potential risk of committing offences against your children, As such there is justification for the bail conditions remaining in place.

If you wish to contest this further then the next step is to make application to a Custody Sergeant at the custody centre at which the conditions were imposed.



  1. 2. Access to a copy of your police interview (email to T/DS Harmer 29th August)


Since you have made this request we have updated you as to our progress in arranging this. I can now report a copy has been made and we will now need to arrange getting this to you. Please advise a convenient time and location for this to be delivered to you.



  1. 3. Access to data regarding material and personnel involved with the investigation. (emails to T/DS Harmer 14th and 19th August and 12th September)


I will attempt to deal with them in order:

The 15 requests raised in your email of 14th August:



  1. Name of immediate supervisor of T/DS Harmer and his supervisor.


I am Martin’s supervisor and my supervisor is DCI Pierre Serra.



  1. Name of superior whom shared info regarding IP address.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Date/month of “first acquired data”.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Source of the data and copy of information…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. The information made available to the Magistrate.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. List of all people participated in the event.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Name of the company that runs the Server.


Sussex Police runs its own server.



  1. Do we record all incoming calls from our desks.


No.



  1. Who wasn’t a police officer on the warrant and how many of the team were men and how many were women.


It would be possible to establish this but haven’t prioritised this enquiry.



  1. Can you say if you were involved with any third party such as Social services prior to the raid…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Were you involved in the repositioning of my former partner a mile or so from where we currently live…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Can you say if you were party to any arrangements by West Sussex County Council…that resulted in the Child Care conference…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Did you or any party related to this raid…participate in the repositioning of Astrid Malgas in this whole picture…if the police had discussions with her which prompted the raid…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Access to all the preparatory work…


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. I would like to know the exact procedure to facilitate me getting access to all the information referred to.


You would need to complete a Subject Access Request to the Force Records Bureau. Process is outlined on Sussex Police external website. As you know I have liaised with the manager of the Bureau and it is their advice that has informed my responses above.

Queries raised in your email of 19th August



  1. Can you tell me the names of the liaising CID officers at Crawley and if they participated in the raid.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.



  1. Could you tell me if the police officers observed at 26 Broome Close in the weeks preceding the raid…were from Crawley CID.


Exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation – whereby the disclosure of the information would likely prejudice the prevention, detection or prosecution associated with ongoing proceedings.

Query raised in email of 12th September

Are you aware of the statements that have been made by Social Workers and at the Child Conference that connect the Bail Conditions to the issues to do with making me homeless and the Raid that you conducted ? I was wondering how this connection came to be made and if it was in fact the intention of this process; and thus the bail conditions to facilitate my removal from my home, making me homeless at 2.30 am , then using the bail conditions to try have have me arrested, then using the bail conditions to bring up an apparent 13 week Housing Benefit matter based on failing a “residence” condition, and so on. The list is all focused on this issue of the bail conditions and making me homeless. I have the recordings and the paperwork related to this matter. I was wondering if you could comment on this as we are actively pursuing the detail of how these bail conditions were set and who you set them in discussions with.

I have dealt with the bail conditions issue earlier in my response. The bail conditions are set in order to safeguard your children. No custody sergeant would authorise conditions for the purpose of making you homeless or to prejudice your housing benefit status. These are significant outcomes in your case, but never an objective of the police action taken against you.



  1. 4. The registering of a complaint about the police handling of your case. (Various emails between yourself, T/DS Harmer and I – 31st July to 8th September)


Although in your last correspondence of 8th September you have stated that you would ‘like to address both the manner in which this case came about and the manner in which this case has been handled, and in particular the actions of officers in my command’, it is as yet still unclear what specific issues you wish to raise.

You wish to be informed of the general and specific procedures for making a complaint and so I will reiterate the advice T/DS Harmer provided you with on 31st July – the best route is to direct your complaint to the Professional Standards Department of Sussex Police:

The Chief Constable, Sussex Police Headquarters, Malling House, Church Lane, Lewes, BN7 2DZ

Alternatively you could



  • Attend a police station

  • Contact the Public Contact Centre

  • Email at *****@******.*** to make a complaint about the misconduct by a person serving with the police.

  • Contact a solicitor or an MP and ask them to make a complaint for you. Nominate a person to act on your behalf (they must have your written consent).


Another option would be to contact the Independent Police Complaints Commission at: 90 High Holborn, London, WC1V 6BH. Tel: 0300(###) ###-####/p>

If your complaint is confined to my staff then I would be able to deal with that, and would suggest meeting to enable to record the matter and investigate the issues you raise. If your complaint also involves my handling of the matter it is best to communicate directly with Professional Standards Department.

Finally, please be assured that, within the confines of our resources and ongoing operational demands, we are doing all that is reasonable to expedite the investigation this end.

Yours sincerely,

Jon Gross

Detective Inspector CG810

***********************************************************************************

***********************************************************************************

SECOND LETTER


Detective Inspector Jon Gross


Specialist Crime Command


Sussex House


Hollingbury


Brighton


BN1 8AF



26th October 2014


Dear Mr McFadden,

Re. Issues raised regarding your case – reference *********** /strong>

This letter is sent as a follow up to my previous correspondence to you on 16th September and is intended to address issues you have raised in emails to me between the 25th September and 21st October.

From the emails received it is my understanding that the collated outstanding issues you require me to address are as follows (I have placed my responses below each point):



  1. One of the issues I would like you to consider as a matter of urgency is returning our Mobile phones and the chips that are associated with them.


I will discus this with Martin Harmer but at this stage they remain part of the forensic material for consideration of examination for the offences under investigation.



  1. Did you authorise Martin Harmer and the Police Officers that attended my home on the 29th May 2014? Did any other senior police officers also give permissions similar to that you gave from other jurisdictions, like Crawley and Horsham or for that matter London.


The warrant application was viewed and authorised by Detective Inspector Jez Prior. No other senior officers or jurisdictions were involved in that process.



  1. Did you and any other Senior Police Officers involved in this case witness the Data described by Martin Harmer in his application to the Magistrate A Rundle on the 28th May 2014 and thus satisfy yourself that this was true and valid?


The data will have been checked by DS Harmer and a summary of this will have been presented to Detective Inspector Prior on the warrant application.



  1. Did you have any concerns regarding the point above? Are you aware that Martin Harmer did not even know of the software I was using on my PC that he claims downloaded or shared or both indecent images of children?


No and no.



  1. I need the names of all the Police Officers that participated in the Raid on my home not allowing me access to their names prevents me from exercising this right to approach senior Officers with my Complaint. Thus I am asking you to reconsider this matter and name all the individuals that participated in that Raid, stating clearly which Police Force they came from and all their Senior Officers Associated.


Previously responded to on 16th September - exemption to disclose under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation. The fact that this information is not being disclosed to you does not in any way prejudice your ability to raise a complaint. Should you do so those tasked with investigating any conduct issues will have access to all records and correspondence regarding this matter and will be able to identify all those involved in the preparation and investigation of this case.



  1. Do you know how many Police Officers were originally allocated to the Raid on my home and can you please tell me this. How can I verify this?


See response at 9 below.



  1. Do you know how many Police Officers came to my home on the day in question as there were a number of Police Officers that attended the site during that day? I am aware that after we left more police officers were called to the site.


See response at 9 below.



  1. Were these Police Officers from your Division or did it include Officers from Crawley.


See response at 9 below.



  1. Can you give me a breakdown of the Police Officers that attended on the day by Police Station please? Can you confirm that ONLY Police Officers attended to this raid in its totality?


On 25th September I provided a figure of an overall contingent of fifteen police officers and police staff who were present at some stage during the execution of the warrant at your home. This included officers from my team, and officers from the local division.



  1. Are you aware that my children were told to leave the house for over four hours?


No.



  1. Can you tell me if your Division, or any other Division involved in this Investigation, BUGGED my home or any other part of the apparatus that we use including telephone and Broadband.


Your home, phone and internet were not bugged regarding this investigation.



  1. Can you say if your Division, or any other that you have been INFORMED of, has bugged my phone and those of my children.


I have not been party to any information that indicates you or your children’s phones have been bugged.



  1. Could you tell me if all the documents and media and phones removed from my home were in fact taken to Brighton, to the Police Station that you attended from?


All exhibits seized are logged, secured and managed according to the Sussex Police standard operating procedures governing the management and movement of property and evidence. In your case all property would have initially been taken to our offices in Brighton to be logged on the force wide property system. Items would have subsequently been moved between our office and the bulk property store in Brighton, as required.



  1. Could you tell me why it was decided that I be taken to Brighton rather than to Crawley when the same facilities exist there?


It is a standard operating procedure for the team to bring persons under arrest to the custody centre adjacent to our office.



  1. Mr Gross has stated categorically that all Internet Services and related are handled on Police Servers in West Sussex. Can you please confirm this?


This was previously responded to on 16th September.



  1. Can you confirm that you did in fact SHOW Mr Jonathan Gross the two sets of evidences that are reported in your suggestions to the Magistrate and to ***** *****.


This is addressed in the answers to 2 and 3 above. I would consider the provision of any further detail exempt under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation.



  1. Can I have the Police documents associated with the matter below, the requirement to have the observations of an ASW and two Psychiatrists on the day/night of my arrest. Here I would like you to forward 1. Internal Police Documents related to this matter. A) Discussions with the Duty Solicitor from Mulrooney Craghill(Kirsty Craghill ) and this to include all audio and video available on the day. B) Discussions with the Psychiatric Nurse and the corresponding report and all the related audio and video of the day. C) Discussions with the other Psychiatric Team Member that did the “social History” part of the “discussion” in the office that was responsible for calling the ASW and the Psychiatrists. Regarding Kirsty Craghill, can you tell me if you as the Police had a previous arrangement to have her attend to this case? Can you tell me which Police Officer selected her for this case and when this was done?


I consider this information subject of exemption from disclosure under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation.



  1. The names of the Team that came to evaluate me, ASW and two Psychiatrists. I need all related information including their initial repost to the Duty Sergeant. The follow up reports that relate to their Station and all related information as to who they are employed by. I would like all audio and video materials including any other related information on the subject. I would like this to include my Custody Record for both days that I was in that Police Station.


You are entitled to a copy of your custody record and can obtain that by attending any custody centre in Sussex and furnishing them with proof of identification and the custody reference number for your case: CR4714009441.



  1. Following the reply by Jonathan Gross, refusing to alter Bail Conditions on the basis of the fact that no “evaluation” was available from Social Services West Sussex, can I have a copy of any discussions related to this contact and the names of all the parties contacted by the Police.


I consider this information subject of exemption from disclosure under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation.



  1. Did you or any member of the Police Team that you lead to my home attend any of the meetings that involved Social Services and Astrid Malgas in the run-up to the Raid on my home that you lead?


This was previously responded to on 16th September as information considered exempt from disclosure under DPA Section 29(1) Crime and Taxation.

I hope this response captures all the matters which you have forwarded to Martin Harmer and I for further clarity or consideration in recent weeks.

Once again, apologies for the delay in getting back to you on these points, as previously stated in my recent emails to you it has been a pressing time with a number of high priority operational matters requiring my attention.

I would again like to emphasise that we continue to press for the forensic work that is underway to be completed as soon as possible.

Yours sincerely,

Jon Gross

Detective Inspector CG810


Expert:  Alex J. replied 2 years ago.
Hi,
Thank you.
It is going to take me a while to review this.
I will revert to you as soon as possible.
Kind regards
AJ
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Fantastic. Many thanks.

Gavin

Expert:  Alex J. replied 2 years ago.
Thank you.
Kind regards
AJ
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hello AJ, any update ?

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Hello my name is ***** ***** I will help you with this.
What is it you want to achieve please?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Hello Alex. How are you. Have you seen the question and the documents related to the question. I have been out all day. AJ was handing this matter but it seems like it has been transferred to you

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Have you complained to the Information Commissioner?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

The first issue here is clearly am I being prevented from this information because it makes the case that the police have commuted a crime. I am sure Alex you remember the Housing Case IO discussed with you. The police are accused by me of attempted murder. They turn up an raid my home. Remove all digital drives. Take my child and hand him to his mother, use bail conditions to ban me from my home, claim I am downloading child porn. Make me homeless etc etc etc. After almost two years of trying to get people to take an interest in my situation I ended up in a cell in Brighton. What you are reading is my questions to the police on this whole matter. They have refused to give me any information I have requested. Have lied about some of the details. The set of questions you see are part of the preparation for a data request. But, because they are using section 29 I cannot make progress. So I need to know if the Data Officer of Sussex Police Julie Page is right to advise as you see above. I need to know if they are right to prevent me knowing this information before I do a data request. This is a big problem. If you want to read more of this issue you are welcom

Customer: replied 2 years ago.

The first issue here is clearly am I being prevented from this information because it makes the case that the police have commuted a crime. I am sure Alex you remember the Housing Case IO discussed with you. The police are accused by me of attempted murder. They turn up an raid my home. Remove all digital drives. Take my child and hand him to his mother, use bail conditions to ban me from my home, claim I am downloading child porn. Make me homeless etc etc etc. After almost two years of trying to get people to take an interest in my situation I ended up in a cell in Brighton. What you are reading is my questions to the police on this whole matter. They have refused to give me any information I have requested. Have lied about some of the details. The set of questions you see are part of the preparation for a data request. But, because they are using section 29 I cannot make progress. So I need to know if the Data Officer of Sussex Police Julie Page is right to advise as you see above. I need to know if they are right to prevent me knowing this information before I do a data request. This is a big problem. If you want to read more of this issue you are welcome

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Have you complained to the ICO yet please?
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I have not. What I wanted to determine is if their actions were legal.

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Section 29(1) states:
(1)Personal data processed for any of the following purposes—
(a)the prevention or detection of crime,
(b)the apprehension or prosecution of offenders, or
(c)the assessment or collection of any tax or duty or of any imposition of a similar nature,
Therefore if they can justify the exemption then yes their actions are legal. I think you have gone as far as you can do with the Police.
What you need to do is now go to the Information Commissioner. They can investigate for free and prosecute for you where necessary.
Their website is: www.ico.gov.uk
But prime facia they can exempt the information.
Can I clarify anything for you about this today please?
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

I would like your opinion on the issue of withholding the reports by the ASW and Doctors at the police station. This is the critical issue. I have not submitted a Subject Access Request to the Police because they are making it impossible to get a clear picture of what I need to know. I need to submit this request by next week.

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
You can request ANY data held by them on you.
Can the ASW and Doctors reports be with-held. Only if it is to do with the prevention of crime - nothing else.
So if it had about a psychiatric condition then yes they could with hold it. But otherwise no.
Does that help?
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Alex, thanks for that. Looking at the questions I have asked is there any information that is clearly not related to crime prevention. Also what determines the description " psychiatric condition" ? I was told to go back home at 2am+ in the morning and the Doctors said I was fine.

Sorry to delay this exchange. I just need to be prepared for the next stage of this matter.

Gavin

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Its hard to say without having sight of the actual documents.
There is no definition as such, but it would be a medical opinion.
I really do think going via the ICO is the best way forward as their powers are extensive.
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Alex there are no documents apart from the bail conditions. What I have tried to do is simply get a picture of what they have done. What I know is that the issue of indecent images of children is a fraud. I accused them of attempted murder. They brought the doctors in to try and discredit me, that I was mentally unstable. This issue has been a theme throughout this process. I was not acting up at all. Thats why I asked them to say why I cannot have the reports related to this event. I want the audio and video footage so that I can watch and listen to what was said. I am convinced that they have set up a major part of this whole story. They have been unable to show any direct link between their raid and information related. I know for a fact that they will never be able to get any data to my computer attached to an IP address. This is a fraud. I will explain to you why at some other point as all my communications are monitored. However, this week I contacted the ministry of justice and asked to be put into contact with their staff. I am saying to them that the evidence or whatever they call it that they took to the magistrate is a fraud. I put it to the police officer that signed off the document that he must tell me that what he saw is what the warrant states. That in fact they have the detail of what they told the Magistrate and that in fact the magistrate saw this detail as described. So far not one single police officer, including very senior police have been willing to say ... yes I saw this information. Why? Because its a fraud. So next week I am going to confront the Ministry of Justice and tell them that in the fullness of time the fact that I told them this and they did not investigate will be an issue. I have nothing to loose.

On the issue of the ICO i need your guidance on how to approach this matter. I am happy to draft this and send it in by Sunday. Its that simple.

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
You just need to log a formal complaint with the ICO - the website has a form and you complete it.
You can consider a Judicial Review of the decision, but the ICO is what you need to pursue now.
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

DO I copy the letter or just state the argument that I am not happy with the way this matter has been handled ? I do not want to do an incomplete job. Next week I am dealing with the custody issues that related to the children being removed and the related issues. I need to tackle this matter from the angle you have suggested with absolute accuracy. I guess I will have to go and read about their rules. I do not want to be told that there is a step I have missed. Administrative law is a nightmare as you know. Can I just go read about this for a few hrs and get back to you if uncertain before Sunday please. ?

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
You can submit the letter together with any supporting documents. But make sure you complete the complaint form.
Of course you can come back to be Sunday.
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Alex, I have had one hell of a problem with my computer. Its mainly sorted now. I will put the ICO document together and tell you about it in a few days. Sorry for the delay

All the best

Gavin

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Yes happy to help Gavin.
Please remember to rate so that I am credited for my time.
Thanks you.
Alex
Ash, Solicitor
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 10916
Experience: Solicitor with 5+ years experience
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Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Today I contacted the JCIO about the original warrant that I believe is fraudulent. A few days ago I contacted the Ministry of Justice. I am going to take this as high as I can. I am doing the ICO tonight and preparing for a child custody matter related to this for the 18th November. My life is hectic and stressful. Have not seen my baby son 6yrs old since June. My family is distressed.

Thanks for your help Alex, as you know you have been of great help to me and my family. I will get back to you when I have done with this part of the problem

Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
yes ICO is the first step.
Alex
Customer: replied 2 years ago.

Will do.