Property Is worth £90,000.
Virtually nothing outstanding hence the urgency to get something done. I would say about £100-£150, due to finish March 2015 but there is already more than enough in the "common" account that we all paid into over the years.
She not made a will that I know of. I'm also apprehensive that she could, or may have been coerced into one
Clare, Following are the relevant clauses from the agreement:-
*In December 1998 it was decided to purchase the property under the local council's Right to Buy policy. Valuation at the time was £36,800 and Frank & Brenda received a 60% discount.
*The main reason for purchase was for the chidren to offer financial assistance to Frank & Brenda as they were pensioners and finding the day to day finances a struggle. All the children were approached and asked to take up a share of the mortgage.
*Subsequently a mortgage was arranged for £20,000 with Alliance & Leicester Building Society and was split as follows:-
£14,720 (i.e. the discounted portion of the house value taken up by the children in the proportions below).
£5,280 (an additional amount taken up by Frank & Brenda to obtain a new car & reorganise their finances).
*Since all other children had mortgages, for simplicity it was decided that John should be the only member of "the Children" to appear on the mortgage. Frank & Brenda had to appear under the Right to Buy
but their purchase was strictly limited to the £5,280 detailed above.
*The £14,720 was taken up in the following proportions:-
Mark 20% (2), Lyn 10% (1), Lesley 20% (2), Alison 20% (2), John 30% (3)
*Lyn decided she could not take up the full share and settled for 10%
Vickie decided she could not contribute at all.
Mark, Lesley & Alison increased their share by as much as they could afford.
John increased his share to take up all the residue.
*Any decisions regarding the property (sale, renting, raising finance etc.) would be by simple majority using the proportions each child has, as their voting entitlement, as shown above.
Because Lyn died in Oct 2013 and we had all agreed that in that situation the "in laws" money should be sorted within 2 months. John delayed and delayed and finally renegaded on the promise.
If he was insisting mum had 60%, I tried to appease him by going along with it. So I paid Denis(Lyn's partner) the sum I calculated as above (ie 10% of the 40% plus a fifth share of the 60%, less Vickies little bit) I don't know if this was a good idea at the time but Denis has agreed with me that he would give back any overpayment I make.
You see this is a fundamental issue that has me bothered. John insisted my mum had 60% purely to keep our names off the deeds yet he is now considerable worse of because he now longer has 30% of the total. He only has 30% of the 40% and he insisted the 60% be shared amongst survivors (he is the youngest). He didn't want Lyn to receive any of the 60% (in my mind, he will wait until another few of us die in order to recoup his losses - so to speak) Even when mum dies he will insist he now has 100% of the house and there is nothing we can do until he says so. Which means he will delay and delay and do nothing
Yes definitely - before this 60% nonsense
Okay. Mum said she owned 60% (of £90,000 which is £54,000).
She realised that Vickie never contributed so she should only get £2000 (just for the sake of giving her something). That left £52,000 split 5 ways between Me, Lyn, Lesley, Alison, John = £10,400 each.
Then there is the 40% (of £90,000 which is £36,000) and Lyn had 10% which is £3,600.
£10,400+£3600 = £14,000.
Thanks for all this - if I could just make some observations/questions.
None of us are interested in forcing sale while Mum is alive, but once she has passed away, how easy is it and how costly? (assuming my brother wont do the honourable thing and he just squats there)
We know Lyn's estate needn't be paid but we put the clause in deliberately to avoid the unlikely situation where Mum has to deal with 5 or 6 in laws if all her siblings died.
John didn't pay the £5500. On my insistence,(I said it was derisory and insulting to my sisters memory) I asked my brother in law to refuse it and I paid £14000 as discussed earlier.
I'm a little confused on this next point; I've have had a quick look at the case law you attached; it seems that Mum does have 60% share because of the discount granted at the outset, despite her never sharing in Insurances, repairs, improvements etc. And this share keeps pace with current pricing. Yet you do say my brothers share increases to 36% (had he paid it anyway!)
My biggest fear is my own death (I have seen my late sister deliberately "cheated"). It seems that everybody gets their share as long as they stay alive, if they die they don't get their portion of Mum's share according to John, (not Mum) - unfortunately she has to go along with what he says. She lives with him and regrettably he is a bullying, control freak but that's another issue. Is there any way I can protect my share, and Lesley and Alison theirs? My Mum is 80, I'm 60 but she's lived a more restrained lifestyle than me so it's going to be touch and go.
No, not that I'm aware of
My solicitor did about 2 months ago showed Mum, Dad and John on the deeds, no charges raised against the property.
Joint tenants - probably the worst decision I ever made, but could not have anticipated this happening. I did all the negotiating back in 1999, talking to solicitors, council, surveyors etc. My mum and dad were a bit naïve, they only knew about council houses, so it was all left to me.
No nothing I'm afraid.
That has considerably set my mind at rest, I'm due to go in hospital in January and hated the thought of my wife being left to battle with this, should anything happen. (I know she may still have a fight on her hands, if I'm not around)
I have spent over 12 months and over £1500 with solicitors in the UK and have found out more in last 24 hours for a marginal sum. I really do thank you for your patience, advice and time.