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Ash
Ash, Solicitor
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 10916
Experience:  Solicitor with 5+ years experience
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Dear Sirs, I have been letting my property to 2 men since

Resolved Question:

Dear Sirs,
I have been letting my property to 2 men since 13th April 2013. They each pay me £350 pcm, total £700 pcm. I will call them Man (A) and Man (B). They work together in a pub, a short walk from my property. Man A being the manager and Man B being the chef.
I took £1,000 deposit from them and placed it in the Deposit Protection Scheme in which they have the details of how to log in etc. Under the DPS both tenants are listed but Man A is the lead tenant. They also paid me one month’s rent in advance.
Since December 2014 I have only been receiving Man B’s rent of £350. I have been chasing Man A , January and now February’s rent.
I have today found out that Man A no longer works at the pub because he has become a manager of another pub. Part of the same chain of pubs.
I met with Man B today who explained that Man A has not been seen at the property couple of weeks. He is very concerned as he is not able to pay the full rent based on this own salary. He told me what pub I could find Man A at and so I went and talked to him.
Man A said that he was only offered this new job at Christmas and had very short notice to accept it. He told me that he is no longer living at my property, albeit he has a few boxes of his personal possessions in his empty room. I asked him why he wasn’t paying me rent or giving any notice or avoiding contact with me. He said because he was waiting to settle down into his new job. He was not answering my calls, texts or emails and he said that he had changed his mobile number. However I do not think there was any intention of returning to the old pub where he worked as a manager because there is a new manager there now on a permanent basis.
After speaking with Man A he later sent me an email to say,
01/02/2015
Dear Landlord.
Notice - 1 month starting from today. The last day will be Saturday 28th February.
Best regards ***** and Man B
I do not know if I can accept this notice because it was only from Man B. Plus it was in email format.
I know Man B wants to stay on at the property and would probably not agree to Man A sending that on his behalf.
Should I be serving them with a Section 21 notice? Or Section 8?
More information – they originally had an Assured Shorthold Tenancy agreement with a fixed term of 6 months. This has since expired as they first moved into the property nearly two years ago. The notice period was 1 month after the fixed 6 month period. I cannot locate this agreement.
More information – when I knocked on the door of my property today a pregnant girl opened the door and let me in. She explained that her boyfriend, Man B, was at work and told me to go see him in the pub. When I spoke with Man B he said his pregnant girlfriend was not living at the flat but stayed over a few nights of the week. She lives at her parents house (supposedly) She is due in 4 weeks time.
Man B said that he would like to stay on at my property and has asked his pregnant girlfriend to move in but she is not working and cannot contribute. He said he has also “asked around” to see if anyone would like to flat share with him but he has had no joy. He has not advertised it. However I strongly doubt he would find anyone because the place is very untidy, messy and look like a squat. There is also major damp in the kitchen which has resulted in the plaster coming off. Guttering was blocked and as a result of heavy rain water has got into the walls. The tenants arranged maintenance man to unblock the guttering and are waiting wall to dry out before they get it re-plastered.
Submitted: 2 years ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Ash replied 2 years ago.
Alex Watts : my name is ***** ***** I will help you with this.
Alex Watts : please let me know what is it you want to achieve ?
Customer:

Firstly, I want the remaining tenant out.

Customer:

Secondly, I want to go after them rent owed.

Alex Watts :

Ok - you need to service a notice to quit asking them to leave. If they refuse then you can issue proceedings . You need to complete form N5

Alex Watts :

http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/n005-eng.pdf

Alex Watts :

The Court will then list the matter hearing and decide whether to give possession, of course the Judge will.

Alex Watts :

As rent - You need to write and set out your losses and request a refund within 14 days or say you will go to Court within 14 days. You should make sure you send this signed delivery and keep a copy.



If they do not refund you then you can issue proceedings in the County Court. You can either do this online at: www.moneyclaim.gov.uk or by completing form N1 http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/n001-eng.pdf and take it to your local County Court.



The Court will then issue a claim which a copy will be sent to the Defendant who will have a limited time to defend it, if not you can enter Judgment and enforce.



If the claim is for £10,000 or less it will be a small claim so you will not need legal representation. Over this value you would need representation .



Can I clarify anything about this today please?

Customer:

Yes please clarify because you have been very vague over the main issue of serving notice and how to go about this.

Alex Watts :

You simply serve a Section 8/21 notice (if an Assured Shorthold Tenancy) on the tenant, or if not such a tenancy a formal written notice

Alex Watts :

Once you have served notice and if they do not quit then you can issue proceedings

Alex Watts :

You would need to complete form N5

Alex Watts :

http://hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/courtfinder/forms/n005-eng.pdf

Alex Watts :

The Court will then list the matter and decide whether to give possession

Alex Watts :

The Court is likely to give possession and if the tenant(s) does not move out you can get bailiffs to evict

Alex Watts :

Does that help?

Customer:

8 or 21?

Alex Watts :

Section 8 if in the fixed period. Section 21 if outside the fixed period

Alex Watts :

Does that help?

Customer:

You are not precise. You haven't read all the information I have given you. "They originally had an AST agreement with a fixed term of 6 months. This has since expired as they first moved into the property nearly two years ago. I cannot locate this agreement"

Alex Watts :

Yes. It is a section 21 then as it has already expired.

Alex Watts :

Do you need a template?

Customer:

Please

Alex Watts :

Hold on

Alex Watts :

http://www.nationalpropertygroup.co.uk/SECTION21CALCULATOR.asp

Alex Watts :

http://www.landlordzone.co.uk/content/section-21-notices (at the bottom)

Alex Watts :

http://www.traceadebt.com/free-section-21-or-section-8/4580991879 (at the bottom)

Alex Watts :

Does that help?

Customer:

Thank you. I am worrying too much about not being able to locate my original written AST agreement.

Alex Watts :

I would not worry about that at the moment. its a periodic tenancy

Customer:

Ok so section 21(4)a ?

Alex Watts :

Technically its a Section 21(4) Housing Act but its just referred to as Section 21 notice

Alex Watts :

Because section 21(4) states:

Alex Watts :

Without prejudice to any such right as is referred to in subsection (1) above, a court shall make an order of a dwelling-house let on an assured shorthold tenancy which is a periodic tenancy if the court is satisfied—


(a)that the landlord or, in the case of joint landlords, at least one of them has given to the tenant a notice [F4in writing]stating that, after a date specified in the notice, being the last day of a period of the tenancy and not earlier than two months after the date the notice was given, possession of the dwelling-house is required by virtue of this section; and


(b)that the date specified in the notice under paragraph (a) above is not earlier than the earliest day on which, apart from section 5(1) above, the tenancy could be brought to an end by a notice to quit given by the landlord on the same date as the notice under paragraph (a) above.

Customer:

Where I have Man A living in my property and Man B supposedly living somewhere else, albeit his stuff is still in my property, should I be serving two separate notices?

Alex Watts :

No, if A is not living there.

Alex Watts :

Sorry I mean B not living there

Alex Watts :

Unless A is named you just ask A to leave.

Alex Watts :

He has no tenancy

Alex Watts :

Only Section 21 if B is living there who is the named tenancy

Customer:

Named? Do you mean named on the original tenancy?

Alex Watts :

Yes

Customer:

Ok so they were both named on the tenancy. Just one seems to have vacated but his mate could always let him back in. Would it be wise to send two individual notices - one to both of them at my property, and one to Man A at another address I have ?

Alex Watts :

Ok, its a Section 21.

Alex Watts :

You only need to serve it on the remaining tenant

Alex Watts :

However the other tenant would remain liable arrears and Court costs

Customer:

2 Where there are joint tenants each tenant must be named on the notice as they appear


on the tenancy agreement. It is not strictly necessary, but it is a good idea to serve

additional copies of the notice, one joint tenant.

And do I have to serve it to them at my property address? Because I know where they work

Customer:

Sorry I just copied that from a link you sent me

Alex Watts :

Yes it should be served at the residential address, not work

Customer:

Why not work?

Alex Watts :

Because it is nothing to do with his work. The rules require you serve at his last known residential address

Customer:

In which case he gave me his address to be the pub. I asked if the flat above had a separate address and he said no. What else can I do?

Alex Watts :

Yes it would be the pub then if he gave you that address

Customer:

Could you confirm - serve notice to both of them jointly, but at two different locations?

Alex Watts :

Correct. Serve joint

Alex Watts :

Does that clarify?

Customer:

Thanks what are my rights if I do as you say and this is incorrect? Are you covered under the law society / SRA?

Alex Watts :

This site is and answers, no client relationship is formed, please see the disclaimer. But yes I am regulated by the SRA.

Alex Watts :

DISCLAIMER: Information in questions, answers, and other posts on this site ("Posts") comes from individual users, not JustAnswer; JustAnswer is not responsible . Posts are information, and are not intended to substitute professional advice (medical, legal, veterinary, financial, etc.), and do not establish a professional-client relationship. The site and services are provided "as is" with no warranty or representations by JustAnswer regarding the qualifications of Experts.

Alex Watts :

But please see my feedback, I have a very high excellent rating

Customer:

Thank you. Is there anything you wish to ask me?

Alex Watts :

I should ask if there is anything you would like me to clarify ?

Customer:

Only if you know any firms that would serve a section 21 notice to my tenants and scare the crap out of them?

Alex Watts :

Well you don't need a law firm to do that. You can do it yourself.

Alex Watts :

But any High Street firm would do this, but it would cost you around £250

Alex Watts :

http://solicitors.lawsociety.org.uk/

Customer:

Any experience with this firm that do it for £79 https://www.thelandlordgroup.co.uk/

Alex Watts :

No experience of them sadly

Alex Watts :

Again I am not allowed to endorse any particular firm!

Customer:

Ok thanks your help.

Alex Watts :

Can I clarify anything else ?

Customer:

No thank you.

Alex Watts :

Great, if I could ask you to rate my answer before you go today, the button should be at the bottom of the screen

Alex Watts :

If you need more help please click reply

Ash, Solicitor
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 10916
Experience: Solicitor with 5+ years experience
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