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Jo C.
Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69992
Experience:  Over 5 years in practice
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I have a question. I had a letter a while ago regarding

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I have a question. I had a letter a while ago regarding speeding offence. I did not receive any letters or other correspondence for more than 6 months and recently I received the letter requesting me to pay for not taking actions. I was to the court to fill statutory declaration where I was asked whether I confirm I was driving the car ("pleaded guilty"). I honestly told I can not remember who was driving the car as me and my wife are both driving it. So they put another date for investigation and advised me if I will be pleaded guilty I will face big fine. I told I am happy to pay the fine now and avoid any further actions but as I don't remember who was a driver I was told I can not be pleaded guilty. I discussed this with my wife and we decided it is more likely I was the driver and I would not like to go to the court if that will cause the problems further. Is there a way to avoid the court process and accept the responsibility?
Submitted: 11 months ago.
Category: Law
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Were you speeding?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
The offence was the speeding. Honestly, I am not 100% sure whether I was a driver or my wife. I stated it during statutory declaration. After discussion with my wife we decided it is more likely it was me but still not 100% sure. I told that in the court. I told them I am happy to pay the fine but they did not accept it as I was unsure. And I was pleaded not guilty as I have not received any correspondence regarding court procedings as it was sent to my old address.
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
Is there a way to be pleaded guilty, pay the fine and avoid further court process as neither I nor my wife can't remember who was a driver. I don't know whether there will be anything regarding failure to provide information about the driver as I had no information about court actions.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Are you charged with speeding or failing to identify?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
As they state I was charged for speeding but I did not respond as I did not get any correspondence and thereafter I was charged for failure to provide information for speeding offence. I just want the case to be closed.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Yes, so is this a charge for speeding or failing to identify or both?

Or a S172 form?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
They mentioned s172
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
Is there a way to close this case without further court actions?
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
Because I was honest during statutory declaration and told I don't know as I don't remember but after discussing with my wife it looks more likely it was me. They did not want to accept I can take responsibility because I told I don't know.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

What I need to know is what stage this has reached now.

What is the document that you have received most recently?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
The only document I received is further steps notice. I attended the court today to fill statutory declaration and I explained situation to you as best as I can. They arranged another court hearing for 24th June.
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
I was not given any other documents.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Did they set aside the finding?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
during statutory declaration they asked me:
1. whether I was driving and responsible for speeding offence - I told I don't know, therefore I was pleaded not guilty and they told it will be investigated and if I will be found guilty there will be huge fine. I asked whether I can accept responsibility and they told me I can not and I can not be pleaded guilty as I am not sure.
2. failure to provide information about the driver - I was pleaded not guilty as I did not receive any correspondence due to change in address. they did not tell me what they will do about it.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Ok.

So did they set aside the finding?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
They were discussing the case with prosecutor and then they mentioned section 172
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Ok.

So did they set aside the finding?

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
I don't understand what do you mean by "they set aside finding". I believe they will be trying to investigate who was the driver. I am happy to take responsibility for the offence even without knowing 100% sure it was me. I just don't want to end up with massive investigation and huge court expenses because they tell I can not be pleaded guilty as I am unsure regarding the driver. As I mentioned, after discussion with my wife we both think is more likely me than her and I am happy to agree with that without further proceedings. Is it possible to be pleaded guilty and pay the fine after I made statutory declaration when they denied me to do that because I am not 100% sure.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

It is really possible to advise on this information.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

If the stat dec was successful then they would normally summons afresh for failing to identify and speeding if they are not out of time.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

If they just reopened the case then they could rely on the summons already laid. That might be what is probable since there is a fresh hearing later this month.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

They would not normally issue a fresh S172 form.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

If you have said that it could be one or other of you then it is possible they could try to investigate which of you is the driver. There is case law that compels them to but they do not normally do so.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

I don't think they can be investigating you for perverting on this information. There just plain isn't a lie.

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
if filled statutory declaration and told I am unsure about the driver and I was pleaded not guilty on both charges, will they investigate it from fresh and I will be paying the fine for speeding offence only? as I was told if they decide I am guilty I will face £600 or more only for court hearing.
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
Because I would better be pleaded guilty and pay the fine for speeding rather going through lengthy court hearing and facing the fine just because they do not accept me being guilty because I am not sure.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

No they will probably pursue you for failing to identify.

They are not going to reissue the conditional offer now.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

If they do charge you with speeding alone then you could plead guilty even though you dispute it. This is not a S172 form. People can plead guilty for any reason they like. What they cannot do though is mitigate on a false basis.

People plead to offences they don't accept all the time. That is what a plea bargain is.

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
I assume my charges will be speeding offence + failure to identify and in the end I will be charged for both?
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
As if I received the conditional offer that would not have gone to the court at all.
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Yes, but you couldn't have received the conditional offer because then you would have to fill out the S172 form naming the driver which you cannot do because you are not sure.

Customer: replied 11 months ago.
the second charge failure to identify can be dropped if I agree more likely I was a driver and I take responsibility for the offence and I will be only charged for the speeding offence? Do I need a solicitor for the hearing or I just provide explanation? And also, the fine for speeding offence + failure to provide information was £811. if they drop the charge for failure to provide information does it mean the fine will go down as well?
Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

Well, it can be dropped for any reason they like but they are only likely to accept it if you offer a plea to speeding.

Expert:  Jo C. replied 11 months ago.

The total sum will probably decrease because you won't be paying the costs of a trial in absence.

Jo C., Barrister
Category: Law
Satisfied Customers: 69992
Experience: Over 5 years in practice
Jo C. and 3 other Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 11 months ago.
thank you very much

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