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james bruce
james bruce, Solicitor-Advocate
Category: Traffic Law
Satisfied Customers: 321
Experience:  Owner at James Bruce Solicitors
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I got a problem with my driving Basically I’m in Uk, but I’m

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Hi
JA: Hi. How can I help?
Customer: I got a problem with my driving Basically I’m in Uk, but I’m driving with my Malaysia license I was held off by a police for my car expired insurance, but after that the police informed me that he would report me as driving without license since I was using my Malaysia license
JA: License regulations vary from place to place, so can you tell me where this is?
Customer: Huddersfield in England, United Kingdom
JA: Do you need to appear in court?
Customer: I’m not sure yet, they just ask me to wait for a post But I think most probably will be yes As the police who held me off reported me as driving without license and no insurance
JA: Anything else you want the Lawyer to know before I connect you?
Customer: I was driving a car I bought, the vehicle is under my name, but the insurance is under my friend’s name, I’m a named driver. And I didn’t realise my car insurance expires I would accept the fact I drive without insurance, but my main point is am I considered as driving without license? I just went back Malaysia this January, for about a month, and then come back to UK
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Would there be any way so I won’t be charged as driving without license? This is my first time offending it, and I really didn’t realise the actual timer is started since the day I came into Uk .

hello I am James a solicitor I will assist you.

Prior to traveling back to Malaysia for the month, how long were you in the UK?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
I think would be probably since September 2017

Hello Payment for call failed but we can continue here, are you ok with that?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya it’s okay

Fine, what is your immigration status in the UK

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
A tier 4 student

and am i right in saying that you are ordinarily resident in Malaysia (your home) and just a student in the UK

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya, but I have been staying here since 2017 September, and only went back to Malaysia this year for a month. But in between I travel to other countries as well

Ok thank you.

It is a very fine point argument whether you have a license to drive in the UK or not.

Ordinarily, you can drive in the UK with your licence from Malaysia for unto 12 months, then you would need to get a UK licence.

Malaysia is not a designated country with the DVLA so you would not be able to exchange your current licence, you would need to obtain a provisional licence and pass the test.

However, the fine line you could argue, is that you left the county and returned home. You then returned to the UK and therefore your 12 month period to drive has started again. This would be the best argument to put forward in court.

Is your address in the UK your permanent address or your student address?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Student address sir
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya I did try to argue with the officer who pulled me over, I told him I went back to Malaysia this year, so would that be possible for the 12-month period to start again

Thenn you should be fine. If you do not have a permanent address in the UK you are nor classed as a resident, and therefore if you leave and then comeback as you have done then the 12 months start over again when you re-entered the UK.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
moreover, the vehicle is under my name, but the main driver for the insurance is my friend, I’m a named driver. Is this fine?
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Is there anyway I can argue for this problem?

Many police officers would not be aware of the fine details of the law, thats why they say they would report you form the offence. It then allows them to make enquires and check the law.

If the vehicle was insured and you are a named driver on the policy you will be fine.

After they stopped you, did they let you continue?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
No, they asked me to leave my vehicle there, and asked me to walk home

What will happe, when they say you will be reported, that means they will make further enquiries and if they find you have committed a driving offence then you would get a letter to go to court. You would then argue your point at court.

However, if they find they have made a mistake you will either receive a letter saying no action, or you may not even hear anything else.

In that case, it is very possible that your friend was actually not insured. It is important to find out from him that he was insured at the time, and that you were named on the policy at that time.

I would be obliged if you could Click the 5 stars at the top of the webpage (this will not cost any extra). This will tell the website that I have responded to your question, you can, of course, continue to ask any follow up questions free of charge. Although you have already paid Justanswer, I won’t be paid for my time from their website if there is no rating left for me

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
No worries, I’ll Give u a five star for sure.
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
also, my friend is definitely insured that time, with my name on that policy

Then it is most likely they were getting an inaccurate reading when they checked for the insurance.

If you do get paperwork in the post to attend court, take a copy of the insurance from that date, also your passport and your driving licence. The court should then sort it all out there and then, and see that you were insured and valid to drive for 12 months.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
What the problem is, I didn’t realise the insurance policy has expired, I would plead to guilty for sure, but I just hope I could be able to drive after I got another insurance plan.

So on the day you were stopped, was the policy in place or had it expired? If it had expired by how long?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya I was stopped today, I think it expired within a month, as I thought the policy should be 12 months but it turned out to be 10 months only.

So this happened today?

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
yaa
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
I’m sure about the no insurance charge, but not about the driving withou license charge
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Officer told me that I will be summoned to court
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Should I try to argue with the police tomorrow when I collect my car? As they keep on telling me that I’m not allowed to drive with my Malaysia license somehow base on the date I first came to UK
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But I’m pretty sure I did went back to Malaysia this January and came back on February, making my 12-month status renewed maybe?

ok, not a problem. As the policy had expired that would be an offence, yes it would be a summons to court. It could take unto 3 months for that to arrive in the post, they take a long time to sort and post, it could come quicker but unto 3 months.

As the insurance had only really just ran our, and it was a genuine error, you thought it was 12 months but was only 10.

The penalty for the no insurance will be a fine and points on licence.

Yes, argue the point about you leaving the county and then returning and as you are not a permanent resident the law states that your 12 months start again when you re-enter.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
basically, I could just apply my insurance again and drive with my license right?

Yes, leaving the county and then returning and as you are not a permanent resident the law states that your 12 months start again when you re-enter.so insurance for the car. you should be good to go.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
but I have been staying at the same accommodation through out the period I was in Uk, I dont think they will consider me as a resident right?
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Would it be possible if you let me know about which law states the identity of an resident? So I got something to back me up when I try to argue with them
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Take a look at the photo I sent sir
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But DVLA stated that students like me are considered as residents ��

As I said at the start it is a fine line, immigration issue including how long you have been in the UK, over a period of time. It really is a legal argument to take to court. Yes that is an issue it would be a point of law argument to take up in court.

The worst the court can do again is a fine and points.

So both offence would be a fine and points.

Until it goes to court , it would be best not to drive and to apply for you provisional UK licence.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
I have had my provisional license, just haven’t take the driving test only.

Do that asap, you would not be disqualified from driving and would be good to show to a court.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya, but the problem is due to the covid 19, we can’t book in any driving test.
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But, is there any law states that when we don’t have a permanent address, we are not consider as a resident?

tests should start again around June 20th.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya, is that faster then the court will summon me?

Most likler, if you were stopped today summons take unto 3 months to send out then the court date on the summons could be 4 weeks after that so you could be looking at a court dat maybe around August/September time.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Because what I really expect is, I won’t be charged for the part of driving without license. I would plead guilty for no insurance, but was trying a way to avoid the no license driving charge

It really is a fine point of law, base more so on immigration law rather than motoring law.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But being a tier 4 student doesn’t mean I’m a resident of uk right, so even the DVLA gives statement like student applied 3-year course is considered a resident, in the immigration law, we are still not resident right?

I would apply for your test as soon as possible so you have it ready for court, then all court will do is fine and give points.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya, i I rented to apply the test but not being able until they allow us to apply
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
I intended*
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But I read about article that driving without license AND no insurance will fine up to £5000 right? Is there anyway to avoid this worst-case scenario?

I think that is all you can do. That is the maximum by law, really never applies.

Most likler worst case outcome would be 6 points on the licence and a fine of maybe £300-£500. The fine would be based on income

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
163;300 fine on the no insurance policy right?

From experience you would be looking at a total of about £500 it is up to the court, but as a student they would keep it lower.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya I hope that would be the best case scenario.

most likely.

Customer: replied 6 days ago.
But somehow I really want to try defy the status of being a resident just because I study here

The best thing could be to speak with a local immigration lawyer near where you live. They would be able to conform for sure what your immigration status would be classed as.

james bruce and other Traffic Law Specialists are ready to help you
Customer: replied 6 days ago.
Ya sure. Thank you so much james